Worth a read

Discussion about World of Warcraft.
Kayce
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Worth a read

Post#1 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:38 pm

Have a gander if you've time to spare:

http://www.incgamers.com/Features/187/T ... -MMO-World
Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important. - T.S. Elliot

Tayto
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Re: Worth a read

Post#2 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:45 pm

I don't think WoW will die imo, its still growing day by day from people of all ages and imo there will be another expansion after WoTLK and maybe set a new gfx engine to keep up the the modern gfx ages of games today. Even if they brought out a 2nd WoW the first WoW would not die for years where as the 2nd WoW would become the new game to play unless they make a bollocks of it.
''somebody's gotta die, if i gotta go you gotta go!''

Kayce
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Re: Worth a read

Post#3 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:05 pm

Yeah, I don't think they'll ever shut WoW down, but It's always been a topic of much debate. What happens to players if such a thing did happen? Frankly, from my point of view, it wouldn't affect me too much as I don't spend all week and all weekend on the game. However, there are ALOT of people that play it to a completely addicted amount, say 8 hours a day 7 days a week at least. If WoW shut down for people such as that, it would be very interesting to find out where they go from there. I wouldn't hesitate in saying that people would go down depression routes, suicide and such (not pointing fingers, but more than likely in America).
Also, how would it affect a peoples general usage of the internet. I would only use it for music, downloading film torrent or such.

I'd like to hear more in depth views on this topic.
Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important. - T.S. Elliot

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Matija
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Re: Worth a read

Post#4 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:23 pm

Kayce wrote:I'd like to hear more in depth views on this topic.


Facts:
a) Blizzard stated that they could upgrade GFX engine at any point. Even without it, people don't play MMO because of the graphics. (Hint EQ, DaoC) From this POV, WoW2 is not needed.

b) WoW has 11 million of active subscribers. That is 11 000 000 x 13euro per month = 143 million of euro. For what? Doing nothing. Doing some sub par content. Do you really think they would close their money making machine?

c) Their next gen MMO won't be a competition to WOW but going for other niche in the market. I'd say, unless they decide for something new (which could totally fail), World of Starcraft is the most probable solution. There isn't MMO coming out that could do anything to WOW. If you ask me, anything but World of Starcraft (which has huge audience, possibly bigger than WOW) could fail due to World of Warcraft being out.
In a perfect world the mentally handicapped will lead the blind.

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Gadessa
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Re: Worth a read

Post#5 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:18 pm

Give world of starcraft!
best quote ever
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Cups
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Re: Worth a read

Post#6 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:12 pm

matija wrote:people don't play MMO because of the graphics. (Hint EQ, DaoC) From this POV, WoW2 is not needed.

HoMM 3 anyone? :wink:

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Igs
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Re: Worth a read

Post#7 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 5:23 pm

Hotseat ftw,endless nights turning into days and so on and so on...gief :)

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Legalized
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Re: Worth a read

Post#8 » Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:02 am

Well, that article starts with one universal truth. Nothing lasts forever. The day will come when WoW will shut down. May not happen during our lifetime, but eventually it will. Why? Because WoW is a product. Every product has it's lifespan. And this brings us to psychology in marketing.

Product lifespan:
implementation (sales have just started)
growth (gaining popularity -> sales go up)
maturity (sales reach peak)
deterioration (sales start to go down, there are more people that cancel subscription than there are those that start it anew)

and than the choice is made... it's either:
a) death (like it happened to TR)
b) revitalization (in MMO case - new content upgrade)

Revitalization puts the product somewhere on the curve with maturity. In time it will start to deteriorate again and the choice will have to be made. Blizzard knows this all too well, that's why they plan and that's why they are successful. As long as they have such a huge player base, there is no chance in hell they will shut down the project. It's a gold mine.

But, eventually the players will grow tired of it and money income will decrease. Only the most hardcore players will remain, but that won't be enough and the MMO will shut down.

How long will that last? Well, there's now way to be sure, but if you look at some other products (coca cola, barbie doll) they have been up and running for 50+ years now. No reason WoW shouldn't beat that. However, how many of us know some product (or better to say some brand) that has been on market for 200+ years?

So, the question is not will it die or not. The question is when will it die. I say not anytime soon.

(sorry, got a little carried away, something to do with my studies)
"Was just waiting for fire to expire."

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Caranlonn
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Re: Worth a read

Post#9 » Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:09 pm

Draenor Set

Azuremyst Isle - 1 to 10
Bloodmyrk Isle - 10 to 20

Eversong Forest - 1 to 10
Quel'thalas - 10 to 20
Hellfire Peninsula - 58 to 62
Zangarmarsh - 60 to 64
Terokkar Forest - 61 to 65
The Deadlands - 63 to 67
Nagrand - 64 to 68
Blade's Edge Mountains - 66 to 70
Netherstorm - 67 to 70
Shadowmoon Valley - 69 to 70

Northrend Set

Borean Tundra - 67 to 70
Howling Fjord - 67 to 70
Dragonblight - 69 to 72
Grizzly Hills - 70 to 73
Crystalsong Forest - 72 to 75
Zul'drak - 73 to 76
Sholazar Basin - 75 to 79
Storm Peaks - 76 to 80
Icecrown Glacier - 78 to 80

Maelstrom Set

Gilneas - 77 to 80
Grim Batol - 78 to 81
Kul Tiras - 79 to 82
Kezan - 81 to 86
Tel Abim - 83 to 85
Zandalar - 84 to 87
Plunder Isle - 86 to 88
The Broken Isles - 87 to 90
The Maelstrom - 89 to 90

Plane Set

Pandaria - 1 to 10
Hiji - 10 to 20

Wolfenhold - 1 to 10
Xorothian Plains - 10 to 20

The Green Lands - 88 to 91
The Dying Paradise - 91 to 94
The Emerald Nightmare - 94 to 97
The Eye of Ysera - 97 to 100

Deephome - 88 to 91
Skywall - 91 to 94
The Abyssal Maw - 94 to 97
The Firelands - 97 to 100

Legion Set

K'aresh - 96 to 99
Argus Meadowlands - 97 to 100
Mac'Aree - 99 to 100
Maw of Oblivion - 100+
The Burning Citadel - 100+++

There's not much more to say than that.
Lead me, follow me or get out of my way.

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Rep
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Re: Worth a read

Post#10 » Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:42 am

there are products that have been around for over 200 years. Twinings of London who make tea are over 300 years old as a company and coffee as a product has been popular for well over 500 years now, for example.

With regards to wow, is there really 11 million active subs running right this moment or is it 11 million subs created since release, regardless whether they're active or not?
i may be gullible, but atleast i have this magic fish

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Matija
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Re: Worth a read

Post#11 » Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:56 am

Rep wrote:there are products that have been around for over 200 years. Twinings of London who make tea are over 300 years old as a company and coffee as a product has been popular for well over 500 years now, for example.

With regards to wow, is there really 11 million active subs running right this moment or is it 11 million subs created since release, regardless whether they're active or not?



11 million active subscribers.
In a perfect world the mentally handicapped will lead the blind.

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Re: Worth a read

Post#12 » Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:33 am

Rep wrote:there are products that have been around for over 200 years. Twinings of London who make tea are over 300 years old as a company and coffee as a product has been popular for well over 500 years now, for example.


Yes, i agree with you to some extent.

But. It's questionable did it survive as a brand whole that time or did they have to change it constantly? HACCP certificates are around for what, 20ish years?

And edible products as such have been around since there's cultivation, so you can't really talk about longevity of products as coffee because you'd have to talk about wow as group game. And group games have been around since the dawn of mankind. (not to mention that we need to eat, while gaming is not something that we need, but rather want)

That been said, we can talk about brands. And wow is a brand from entertainment sector. Considering the speed world is changing, my opinion is that it will last for 20ish years before something new takes it's place. Perhaps I gave it too much, perhaps too little. Time will tell.
"Was just waiting for fire to expire."

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Yorkaturr
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Re: Worth a read

Post#13 » Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:10 pm

The fundamental thing I disagree with in the article is this:
There's also that old chestnut about people who are reluctant to leave an MMO for a new one because they would miss their friends in the old game. I just refuse to believe that's the only reason people can't stick to a new game, maybe they just don't want to admit they can't kick the habit and get into something else?

Now, I have been playing a game called BatMUD (http://www.bat.org) from early 1997 (here's a link to my character: http://www.bat.org/char/yorkaturr, to give some perspective the character age is indeed real life years spent online). To those of you of the younger generation, MUDs are the original MMOs, text-based games hosted on a single server and played over a telnet client. It is from these games that graphical 3D MMOs like EverQuest and World of Warcraft have eventually evolved. The game has existed since 1993, and the major reason for it is that since it is not a commercial product, the only way its lifespan is limited is through the dedication and interest of its developers who, being volunteers, have that interest by definition. One of the resulting phenomena in such a setting is that the game remains fairly stable and predictable. One doesn't need to worry about the developers embracing new commercial opportunities sometimes at the expense of quality (think, for example, all the whine about too easy content in WotLK, which Blizzard even admits was tuned that way to keep more casual subscribers happy rather than improving the game as a form of art or a technological wonder).

In addition to being a static sandbox in the gameplay sense, BatMUD has several mechanisms for handling game-wide communities. Several public channels can be joined by anyone, used anywhere in the game world, and are moderated actively by the developers who also join into the discussions held therein. The features of a static game world and an open community combined, the community in BatMUD is very tightly-knit and very well self-moderating. The loltroll screaming polish on public channels won't last a minute.

Perhaps it is due to the sheer amount of players or a lack of interest in providing such mechanisms, but World of Warcraft just like every other MMO that has been on the market doesn't provide any effective tools for handling communities. MMO communities need to rely on external, improvised applications in order to exist, just like these forums we have. Remember old days on Burning Legion with an active IRC channel? "Lol Mantrid, I pwned you, someone tell Victorinox he's a d0rf lal". That is the type of community I am talking about. World of Warcraft is dominated by guilds, which by definition are exclusive, resulting in several separate communities which rarely if ever communicate. In practice this means that World of Warcraft effectively encourages people not to form communities within the game but rather to play with real-life friends.
Last edited by Yorkaturr on Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger. Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup." --Terry Pratchett

Skum
Posts: 189

Re: Worth a read

Post#14 » Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:24 pm

My personal opinion is that WoW is so dynamic in the way that it is delivered (i.e. instant updates, massive community feedback, consumer-led product, monthly subscription payments) is that it could potentially last a lot longer than we would expect.

Ultimately, if it is around in 40 years time, it may still be under the "World of Warcraft" title but it will be so different to the WoW we know today that effectively, it will be a different product altogether.

I think a reasonable analogy would be to compare it to music. We don't "need" music as such, but it has been around since humans first learned to hit shit with sticks. Music is always changing massively, not only in how it sounds, but how it is channeled to us. Some musicians (Michael Jackson most recently) are/will be churning out more crap nearly 40 years after they first started. It seems the only limiting factor for continuation is the fact that the artists at some point become old and unable to perform. WoW won't have this problem.

At the moment, Lore is probably the only limiting factor as to why we can't seem to go on for too long; but there are loads of easy fixes for that. Only Blizzard's imagination and business decisions would limit WoW going on indefinately.

Kayce
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Re: Worth a read

Post#15 » Fri Mar 20, 2009 1:20 pm

Skum has hit the nail on the head.

World of Warcraft is as titled based entirely on the 'Lore' of of this made up world. Although they can always bring out new expansions making up lore as they go however, It will not be the same as being 'based' on the exact Warcraft Lore.
Regarding this facter; many 'lore lovers' may feel that the game is over once the statuatory story is complete. Another thing to build on, is that expansions after Warcraft lore is over will (more than likely) repeat previous Lore tales and situations, becoming a cycle whereby people will feel that the game is complete and would move on to say perhaps another MMO or quit entirely.
This isn't going to happen soon as there's still Lore to be implemented, but it's also not that far away either.
Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important. - T.S. Elliot

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